Interview

An Historian Looks at Rohingya

By THE IRRAWADDY Wednesday, October 7, 2009

COMMENTS (38)

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Dr. Aye Kyaw has written books on education and culture in Burma. He was born in Lwe Chaung village in Taungok Township in Arakan State. He has a BA in history and religion, an MA in Asian history and a BA in law from Rangoon University. He earned a Ph.D in Southeast Asia History at Monash University in Australia.

Dr. Aye Kyaw taught at universities in Burma, Thailand and the US. Now retired, he lives in New York city.

While visiting Bangkok, he was interviewed by Ba Saw Tin on his views on Arakan history, politics in Burma and the debate over Rohingya history and their troubled relationship with the Burmese military government.

Question: Describe Arakan politics before Burma's independence?

Answer: Arakan leaders always joined in Burma's struggle for independence. They participated at the forefront in the struggle against British colonial rule and the Japanese invasion. If someone asks why they participated, it was because the Arakan wanted to rule themselves. The prominent Arakan leaders during British rule were Monk U Seinda, monk U Pyinnya Thiha, U Nyo Tun, U Aung Zan Wai, U Kyaw Min, U Ba Saw and others. These leaders were prominent figures in the Arakan resistance movement and Arakan politics. Monk U Ottama was one of the first leaders in Burmese politics.

If you look at the situation of the Arakan under British rule, there were two groups. One group worked with the British, and one group joined in the independence struggle led by Gen. Aung San.

U Nyo Tun was a famous student leader in the 1936 student strike, and he was quite well-known in both the Arakan and Burmese community. While Burmese acknowledge March 27 as marking the beginning of the resistance movement against Japan, the Arakan had already started their resistance against Japan earlier, around Feb. 12 or 13.

Q. What happened to the Arakan after the independence struggle?

A. The main reason they fought was to get their own state and self rule. Unfortunately, when Burma won independence, nothing came of it. They asked Prime Minister U Nu to grant them a state, but U Nu evaded the issue.

Q. How did politics development during the following years?

A. During U Nu's Anti Fascist Peoples' Freedom League (AFPFL) rule, there were two powerful political parties in Arakan State: The AFPFL and the Arakan Unity Party (AUP). U Kyaw Min led the AUP. U Aung Zan Wai and Taung Koke U Kyaw Tin led the AFPFL in the Arakan region.

Then the AFPFL split into two factions: the "stable" AFPFL and the “clean” AFPFL. The clean AFPFL faction leader, prime minister U Nu, set up Mayu District in Arakan State. He registered Bengali as citizens through national registration and allowed them to vote. During the Colonial era, the Bengali started coming into Arakan to work. They mostly worked in the agricultural sector, and then returned when the work was done. One of the prominent leaders among Bengali was Sultan Mahmud. The AFPFL was weak in a sense. When U Nu allowed Bengalis to enter Mayu District that was the beginning of today’s Rohingya problem.

Q. Do you know when the use of the term "Rohingya" began?

A. I think it appeared during the 1960s. Because even the Bengali leader, Sultan Mahmud, when he became a member of parliament, I don’t think he used the word "Rohingya." In earlier Burmese history and in Arakan history, I haven’t seen the word Rohinhya. Even after independence, there was no such word.

Q. What does "Rohingya” mean?

A. When Sayagyi U Tha Tun was in good health, we visited whenever he was in Rangoon. We had conversations on several themes: literature, history and other social matters. Once, he explained to me the meaning of Rohingya. The word derived from an Arakan word, Lwintja.

Lwintja in Arakan means leaves falling from trees and blowing around without any purpose.

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COMMENTS (38)

Kyaw Tun Wrote:

17/10/2009

Let's examine and expose a few of these puzzles.

We, Arakanese people, do not recognize the term so-called "Rohingya." We accept them evidently as Chittagongnian Bengalis or Bengalis who are illegal migrants from Bangladesh.

We will not tolerate illegals in the country. However, we would like to solve peacefully all of these questions in accordance with our national security, national integrity and national interest.

It is not an evasive answer.

Okkar Wrote:

17/10/2009

The differences between Chinese and these Bengalis is that the Chinese aren't claiming to be some phantom ethnic group, trying to manupulate historical facts to support their claims with the help of pro-Islamic opposition supporters, claiming an Islamic state within Myanmar.

These facts made the Bengalis unwelcome in our country.

Moe Aung Wrote:

16/10/2009

KKK,

The Chinese have their own sub-state called Kokang awarded by their British masters in 1947 for services rendered in the fight against the Japanese. You can bet they would never have got one after independence.

The Chinese in Mandalay and the North do not proclaim an independent state of their own. Remember the Chinese were not alone but together with the Indians when they used to dominate the economy before Ne Win came along to end it.

The 'Rohingya' should stop wasting their time, and their lives more to the point. Get smart.

PLan B Wrote:

16/10/2009

Ko Moe Aung
Another true "Sticky" for a reminder of all those who use religion, skin color or any difference for discrimination, whether Rohingya or Burmese, Islam or Budhism.

All are just cover for racism under the guise of nationalism, terrorism or even human rights to justify their hate inspired rhetoric.

KKK Wrote:

15/10/2009

To Moe Aung: I am not sure you are pure Burmese or not. What would say about millions of Chineses who are living in every part of Burma. 95 percent of businesses are owned by Chineses. How do you feel about that? If you are okay with these Chinese, why not Rohingyas? Do you discriminate?

Sittwethar Wrote:

14/10/2009

In Thailand, it is said that there are hundreds of thousands of hill people who have been living in the Kingdom for generations but are still denied their citizenship rights. It is said that the government uses a few colors to distinguish their (hilltribes) status and, depending on card's color,movement restrictions are imposed on them.

It is said that their constitution is a democratic one guaranteeing all rights as a democratic society. But still there are many who are not included in these benefits.

Why? Think about it. If you consider all issues from the point of human rights and so on, and not from the point of national security and national interest and longevity of your entity, it is no wonder your debates will be on another course.

We are at a difficult juncture due to our activist status. We are expected to take the course of human rights and so forth since we are a downtrodden and oppressed people. We are not supposed to view this issue from the point of National Security and anything like that. Think

Moe Aung Wrote:

14/10/2009

KKK,Ngal Hriang,

It's your choice to join the Taliban - why not in Pakistan, it's closer than Afghanistan. Unfortunately for you, the Rakhine achieved supremacy in the Arakan way back before the Burman did in what we know today as Burma.

Minority rights must be honored, but secessionist movements are bound to be resisted whatever regime rules Burma. The military after all justifies its rule by this very premise.

You'd have to contend with the Burmese in general (You do realize that urban folk are by and large not pure Burman?) and the Rakhine in particular. Your Muslim brethren abroad can only make matters worse for the 'Rohingya' as you are bound to be seen as their proxies and agents of Islamization.

You don't stand a chance. Desist.

Shwe Min Wrote:

14/10/2009

Thank you Sara Aye Kyaw.

I'd like to respond to Oo Mg Gyi:
"There were many Muslims who participated in the Burmese independence movement, a fact which he overlooks." The interview did not have a related question, so you are speculating an answer. Also, all Myanmar muslims are not Bengalis.

To KSoe: "I am sure none of those Rohingyas are trying to extend Islam in Burma or Arakan State." Let's not be so definitive. More recently in Chittagong Hill Tracts, the Bangladesh Army uncovered a Jamaat Islamiyah training camp (check the Bangladesh daily Star newspaper) that had "Rohingya" members. Some time ago the New York Times magazine had a story of budding Jihadist students in Afganistan coming from far flung countries, including Myanmar.

The "Rohingyas" in the Bangladesh/Myanmar border are called "Bormaiyas" - meaning Bengalis living on the Rakhine side, similar to how Bengalis in Chittagong are called "Chatgaiyas," meaning living in Chittagong. These terms are used in the local Bengali dialect.

Okkar Wrote:

13/10/2009

Ko Ngal Hriang,

You mean "People move around for many reasons. The Bengulis, who claim to be phantom race called Rohingya, are among them."

Ngal Hriang Wrote:

13/10/2009

Ko Wa Thone Oo,
Many Burmese who are currently in Malaysia entered into Malay illegally. Many Burmese, many Mons, many Chins and many Rohingyas are there illegally.

At the same time, many Burmese citizens who fled into India do not have visas. They just entered into India without any kind of documents. Even when they get detained there, they still get treated as human beings.

I know many Burmese who entered into the US without any kind of documents through Mexico, but they are treated by the US authorities with respect and dignity as human beings.

We cannot ask the Burmams who reside today in lower Burma to go back to Pagan and Ava and Mandalay claiming that lower Burma was a Mon Kingdom in the past.

People move around for many reasons. The Rohingyas are among them.

KKK Wrote:

13/10/2009

I totally agree with Ksoe, Ngal Hriang, and Maung Zaw. I want Dr. Aye Kyaw to write someting about Kokang and the Chinese who are mercilessly sucking the Burmese people's blood. Why don't historians like Dr. Aye Kyaw write something about the Chinese in Burma. I just want to see some fairness.

I think all Rohingyas should join the Taliban in Afghanistan and fight for the Rohingya State.

Okkar Wrote:

12/10/2009

This whole rohingya myth is based on the "camel and arab" story. Once an arab was travelling with a camel in the desert. At night, he camped by an oasis and erected his tent to sleep in. The camel asked arab if he could keep his nose inside the tent because it was cold. The arab allowed it out of kindness. A few minutes later, the camel asked the arab if he could keep his head inside the tent; again the arab allowed it. Then its asked to put in its neck, its front legs, then its humps, and so on. In the morning, the camel was sleeping inside the tent and the arab was sitting outside frozen to death.

This is what the Rohingya supporters are failing to appreciate. First they are recognized as a race, second they get a seat in the legislative council, third they establish autonomy and fourth they create Arkistan.

Those who support the creation of an Islamic Terrorist state under the guise of democracy and human rights in Myanmar do so at their own peril!

wathoneoo Wrote:

12/10/2009

Ko Ngal Hriang,

This is in response to your comment. First, please be aware that Burmese entering any third countries to seek intellectual and material refuge are legal migrants. But, the people who recently named themselves 'Royingyas' certainly did not enter Arakan through a legal framework. This is the basic difference.

Secondly, i am surprised that you compare countries like America with Arakan. If you do not know, Arakan is a marginalized State in a dictatorship with no minimal intellectual and material defense for their survival. America is a world-power.

If you were an Arakanese, I know you wouldn't have room in your heart for compassion when you realized that a population in excess of 30 percent of your own race belonging to different traditions came to assert equal power to shape the political and cultural landscape of your own people.

If you are a fellow Burmese, and you believe Arakan is a part of Burma, you have a choice between Rakhine and 'rohingya' for your compassion.

MW Wrote:

11/10/2009

There is a famous syaing that runs "Charity begins at home". And there was a famous historical event of the Portuguese immigrant Ngazinka (Debrigto?)asking for a plot of land, just the area of a buffellow skin, in Syriem (Thanlyin), which was granted by the kind-hearted but not very cunning king of Hanthawaddy - the rest is still an amusing memory, albeit a painful one.

After all we are not much different at the moment from those unfortunate people, in a sense that both peoples are being displaced literally and gradually by their own states.

However unless and until we can dispense with the ominous Military State hovering on us, it is we who are more to be pitied. And the onus is on us to do something about it.

Salai Biak Wrote:

11/10/2009

Okkar,

I do not advocate for the Rohingja. To be sure, I don't agree at all to grant them the same status with Arakhans and other ethnic groups. "seven ethnic groups" is enough.

But, the Rohinja people should be treated humanely on conditions, such as if they surrender their terrorist-like activities.

I'm sad to hear what Kyaw Tun said. In the end it must be the Arakhan people who make the final decision. I would like to see a referendum asking whether the Arakhan people want to accept them or expel them from their territory.

Moe Aung Wrote:

11/10/2009

Not a lot of people know that the Mujahid rebellion in the Arakan and U Seinda's Arakanese nationalist rebellion along with the Red Flag Communists predated the others, starting in late 1947.

The mainstream Communists in March 1948 were followed by the Karen in January 1949, and the rest much later.

And of all the separatist movements, the Muslims in Arakan manage to alienate and rankle the most, the Burmans in general and the Rakhine in particular.

Granted all must be fairly treated, indigenous, immigrant, whatever. There's no excuse for inhumane treatment in any shape or form. Equally there's no room for wild historical and territorial claims which will only further alienate and rankle.

Community leaders must know their responsibilities as well as the rights, and avoid the mistake of making their people's lives even more miserable than they already are. Fight for your rights by all means, but cross the line and suffer the consequences if your goal is an independent Islamic state.

Sai Soe Win Latt Wrote:

11/10/2009

Arakanese and Rohingya fight; KNU and DKBA fight; SSA and UWSA (and Pao almost) fight; KNPP and KNLP fight; Muslims and Buddhists fight; Kachin also fight. Meanwhile, the SPDC-China-Thailand-India exploit gas, oil, gems, hydroelectricity, agriculture, border trade, labour, even foreign aid.

What's with all this? Isn't 50 years of poverty and starvation enough?

What has been the status of the Burman, Kachin, Rwan, Karenni, Kayaw, Kayan, Karen, Chin, Naga, Mon, Arakanese, Shan, Tai Loi, Tai Noi, Wa, PaO, Lahu, Akha, Rohingya, Kaman, Pathi, Kuki, Eikaw, Lisu, Buddhist, Muslim, Christian and Hindu people in Burma?

We are all poor and oppressed refugees.

I sincerely wish good luck to Burma.

Naing Soe Wrote:

10/10/2009

Is there anyone who can safely say with sound proof that there were the words Myanmar, Rakhine, Rakhine State, Yangoon... in the ancient history of what is now Myanmar? Why is Rohingya the only word singled out?

Kyaw Tun Wrote:

09/10/2009

Why are the Arakanese concerned?

These Bengali illegal migrants have created a lot of issues in Arakan since the Mujahid Party ramped up its presence in the 1950s under the guidance of Muslim fundamentalists from Rangoon.

Their aim is to grab a part of Arakan State between the Naff River and Mayu to build a Muslim state called Arkistan.

The Mujahid armed struggle murdered Arakanese who lived in Moung Taw and Buthitoung Township. Monks were killed, women were raped and over a hundred Villages and Monastery were eradicated by the Mujahid insurgency.

In 1993, the so-called Rohingya Solidarity Organization attacked Moung Taw Township with the statement "Jihad War Starts in Arakan"

They are now claiming ethnicity as Rohingya's to have legitimate rights of territorial possession using an unacceptable fake story.

Please everyone, you should not believe this.

Moe Gyaw Wrote:

09/10/2009

I grew up in Rakhine state but never heard of any Bengali requesting for a debate. Why didn't they do it when they had a chance in Rakhine state and why now?

okkar Wrote:

08/10/2009

The funniest thing is these people couldnt even make their mind up on the spelling on their own supposed "ethnic" name.. is it Rohinja or Rohingya or Rohingyar?

To Salai Biak, to quote your own words.. "Rohingja are said to have been in Arakhan area for more than 50 years", said to have been does not mean its historically supported fact. It is mere heresay and teh claims are random... there have been no historical facts that support the Rohingya as a race. If you take DNA profiling of these so-called Rohingya, you will invariably find that they are just Bengalis.

U Nu made promises to them for his own political benefits, just as the NLD, Su Kyi and exiled politicians are doing now.

Aung Ko Wrote:

08/10/2009

Very controversial issue. Whether it is true or not, it is definitely nothing to do with the improvement of poor Burmese people's lives. These ideas come from hypocrital intellectuals who are far from democracy and Buddha's Dhamma.

Ahyu Wrote:

08/10/2009

Currently the most famous poet in United States said 1300 years ago "Out beyond ideas of wrong doings and right doings, there is a field, I will meet you there"
Loving compassion is much more powerful than hypothetical truth.

I simply want to say I tremendously admire and respect the comments from Ksoe, Ngal Hriang, Maung zaw and Oo maung Gyi for their kind hearts.

Salai Biak Wrote:

08/10/2009

Among many others, the "Rohingja" issue is the most sensitive which many Burma watchers shy away to comment. The UNHCR-Myanmar's sole task is to help these vulnerable people, but it seems they face many govt restrictions.

The "Rohingja" are said to have been in Arakhan area for more than 50 years, this as a case in point. If U Nu really granted them a state, special consideration should be given to them now. As a matter of fact, there is no Burman, Chin or Kachin origin. We all came from Tibet/China (Mongoloid group), just like the Rohingja came from Bangladesh. We need to learn to live in a plural society. (our differences should not be subject to political exploitation)

okkar Wrote:

08/10/2009

Irrawaddy has censored my comment on this thread because it was not in-line with their pro-muslim/pro-islamisation stance.

Dr. Aye Kyaw is a respected historian and what he said in the interviews are facts, although Rohingya sympathisers and people who support creation of Islamic state within Myanmar find the facts Dr. Aye Kyaw put forward unacceptable.

As usual, a personal smear campaign has started on one of Myanmar's educated scholars simply because he has the courage to stand up and dispell the myth of Rohingya. This just goes to show how pro-islam the NLD, The Irrawaddy and democracy supporters are.

Andrew Aung Khaing Wrote:

08/10/2009

Please be careful in the usage of "Arakan". Use "Arakan" when you refer to the country or state. But, when you refer the people, it should be "Arakanese",not "Arakan". So, "many Arakans" is grammartically not right and it should be "many Arakanese". Thanks to Dr. Aye Kyaw for telling the truth.

Alex Tan Wrote:

08/10/2009

May I have Dr. Aye Kyaw's email address or any other contact number (kindly send to my email)? I am currently looking for some Burmese historians to help do a research cum documentary on our Burmese culture. If there are any other burmese historians you could recommend, do let me know too.

Really appreciate your help.

Best regards,

A. Tan.

Anuar Wrote:

08/10/2009

It's a very intresting Story! It will be more intresting if Dr. Aye Kyaw has time to sit with Rohingya Leaders and have a friendly debate on related matters.

I hope Irrawaddy can manage to facilitate such a meeting regarding.

Thank You.

okkar Wrote:

08/10/2009

So thats settle then.. there was no such thing as "Rohingya".. it was just a made up word.. so why are Su Kyi and opposition supporters hell bent on helping the islamisation of Arakan state?

Zam Mang Wrote:

08/10/2009

One Chinese in Mandalay told me that he got his Burmese Citizen Card as cheap as $ 300 from a Burmese Immigration Officer. Therefore, Mandalay is now a Chinese capital in Burma.

Rohingyas also were introduced into Burma by U Nu for his own benefit according to Dr. Aye Kyaw. Neither U Nu nor Ne Win nor Sein Lwin nor Maung Maung nor Saw Maung nor Than Shwe cares about the Union of Burma when it comes to personal benefit.

Oxonian Wrote:

08/10/2009

Well said Professor, and great interview!

We must never allow such non-Myanmar people to be overtly creative with their self-branding. Even when a new government comes after SPDC, (or even DASSK) we must never recognise such opportunists.

john badgley Wrote:

08/10/2009

I like the chance to add a footnote to Saya Aye Kyaw's interview. I extend back in time, perhaps a decade, the use of Rohyingya as a descriptor of residents along the Naaf River. When I interviewed leaders in Maungdaw in 1957, that was how they identified themselves, as did my Akyab Buddhist colleague. I'm sure others will add clarity to our vague answers.

ksoe Wrote:

08/10/2009

Dr. Aye Kyaw
With all due respect, you are presenting many conflicting and biased ideas on the issue. I am sure none of those Rohingyas are trying to extend Islam in Burma or Arakan State. They are too busy struggling for their own existence while some people like you and the current military government are denying their existence.

Rohingya is just a name. I am sure they are Bengalis who moved into Arakan State a long time ago. People migrate from country to country all the time and their generation becomes citizens or nationals of the new country cause they are born there. It is very narrow-minded to deny that.

You said they are not citizens, then, how come they had Sultan Mahmud as a member of parliament? And how come they participated in the 1990 election? You can’t deny point-blank there were no Rohingya(or Bengali) before they were granted citizenship by U Nu. You have to consider their geographical location.

We just need to accept the differences and create a better place while living in the same country.

thu ri ya burma Wrote:

08/10/2009

Good point. He is a really scholar. In 1978, I suppose, the Burmese Social Program Party accepted Bengali refugees under the Hintha project.

the middle man Wrote:

07/10/2009

Dr. Aye Kyaw said the Rohingyas are funded by Islamic orgs in N. Africa, Middle East and Malaysia. It would be very interesting to know what his evidence is.

The interviewer should have taken a little longer on it, as this is controversial and could be misleading.

Ngal Hriang Wrote:

07/10/2009

Whether Rohingyas are an ethnic group of Burma or not, they must be treated humanely. We the citizens of Burma who fled the country are being treated by US, Australia, and so on with respect and dignity. In our turn, we need to treat these Rohingya in a humane way. But I do not understand the phrase "An Historian..."

Maung Zaw Wrote:

07/10/2009

So, Dr Aye Chaw worked with Dr Maung Maung for Ne Win's Goverment. I beleive Dr Aye Chaw got a chance to study in Australia from the support received from Ne Win's goverment.

What about Dr Than Tun's comments for Rohingya. I am really sorry for The Irrawaddy to give a chance to advocate the hatred for pityful and vulnerable community.

Oo Maung Gyi Wrote:

07/10/2009

Dr Aye Kyaw has some of his facts wrong regarding the historical background.

Mr. Sultan Mahmood was Minister of Health during U Nu's Cabinet. He omitted the First Rangoon University Student Union was U Kyaw Khin, a Muslim from Sandaway (now Thandwe. There are many Muslims from Buthidaung and Maungdaw from the time of Arakanese Kings.
U Nu had given the status of Rohingya, whether it was ethnic or not but it was a fact. Arakanese word “Lowong” means strays like a leaf from the tree falling on the ground.

I would like to meet Dr Aye Kyaw and discuss this issue because he does not know the reason behind its creation at the time of U Nu's Prime Ministership. I was in politics during the time of U Nu's regime. Dr. Aye Kyaw was never been in politics since his student days.

There were many Muslims who participated in the Burmese independence movement, a fact which he overlooks.